As a last question, what do you think?

Is there any way to convince a narcissistic to go to your therapy? And what kind of thing a narcissistic would gain attending your therapy?

A narcissist would never attend my therapy or any therapy unless he hits rock bottom, unless all areas of his life collapse simultaneously. His interpersonal relationship, his family, his business, his standing in society, his reputation, maybe his freedom if he goes to jail.

A narcissist needs to lose absolutely everything. And even then, the narcissist attends therapy, not because he thinks something is wrong with him or he wants to heal, but he thinks that he is not functioning properly. He wants to be fixed, like a garage. Something is wrong with my oil. Can you check my oil pipe? I didn’t know everything worked perfectly and last year is not working perfectly. Fix me. Fix me so that I can continue to be the same. Don’t fix me. Don’t change me. Just fix me so that I continue to be the same.

So, a narcissist would come to cold therapy would first of all be what we call a collapsed narcissist. A narcissist with all pervasive failure, failure that affected and infected every area of his life. And catastrophic failure, cannot recover from it. And that is called a collapsed narcissist.

The second thing is, we would need from the very beginning to get rid of the notion that the aim of therapy is to restore the narcissist. It’s not, it’s to destroy the narcissist. The therapy is hostile. That’s why I call it military boot camp. Therapy does not collaborate with the narcissist, narcissism, or with his hopes and wishes and dreams. Therapy, the therapist is the narcissist enemy, absolute enemy. And his aim is to destroy the narcissist. It’s the only hope of rebuilding.

So, we need to get rid of this notion that a doctor listened until now everything went well. Last year I lost my wife, I lost my business, I lost my children, I lost my freedom, I lost my Jaguar. And can you fix me so that I can get my Jaguar children back? That needs to be gotten rid of very early in the therapy. I’m not here to fix the narcissist. I’m here to get rid of him.

And then the third phase is a phase of reconstructing the narcissist in a way that would make his life more functional and presumably more happy. The experience is much more happy. Former clients are much more happy. They’re much more happy because they’re much more functional and they don’t need this huge amounts of energy because narcissism consumes enormous energy all the time. And suddenly all this energy is released and they can use it. It’s like a huge gift. There is a Christmas gift they’ve ever seen. What to do with this energy? It’s like getting money, a lot of money.

Oh, I can travel in a yacht, I can garden, I can bake bread, whatever. It’s energy.

And so usually the narcissist finds himself after cold therapy in another life with other interests sometimes, other occupations or other activities. And definitely without all the narcissistic elements, for example, without activities whose only role and main function was narcissistic supply.

Because narcissists dedicate most of their activity to get supply. They don’t really love what they’re doing. They don’t love it. And very often they feel that they are forced to do it. But without this activity, they will not get supply.

So they continue. They continue.

And so you get rid of these activities.

Narcissist can benefit a lot from cold therapy if he survives. It’s a dangerous therapy for a narcissist.

But there’s no other home. Simply no other home.

And because the narcissist destroys first everyone around him and ultimately himself, then must be done.

When we treat, I used to be advisor to rehab centers around the world, Israel, United States. When we treat our colleagues, when we treat drug addicts, they go through similar processes.

Very difficult phases. They want to die. The body reacts horribly. And some of them, I have a surprise for you. It’s a well kept secret.

Some of them die in rehab centers.

So we’re not alone.

But there’s no hope except this.

A narcissist in cold therapy needs to die. Must die. Or he cannot be reborn. And he will die anyhow. Even without cold therapy. And he will die much more horribly without cold therapy.

So a rational choice is to attend cold therapy. Even with the risks, even with the pain, even with the horrible experience. It’s a horrible experience.

But it’s a rational choice.

Thank you so much for being here and helping to understand Hungarian people a little bit more about you and your work. Thanks again.

Thank you for having me. It was fascinating interview. Thank you. Thank you.